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 Post subject: Obsidian Relaunch.
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 4:11 pm 

Joined: Fri Sep 10, 2004 6:34 am
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DO NOT POST HERE

This post is intended to be discussed by staff, so please do not post here for any reason. There is a discussion post in Obsidian Discussion (viewtopic.php?f=2&t=39853) where we can talk about adding, removing or modifying stuff.

So me and some other players came to conclusion that those are the main points that have to be tweaked to have at least obsidian ready for a relaunch.

PvP:

Necromancers:
-Damage of Firewhip has to be changed. Sometimes Firewhip damages for 120+hp and it’s ridiculous. We would like that the max dmg should be capped at 80 (As per capped we mean capped, not that it has always to dmg 80)
-Firewhip delay has to have a cap. We noticed that players with high dex can cast 3 firewhips in a row with no delay. No mage, warrior nor pvm can survive to such spam. Please fix this matter, put at least a 2 or 3 second delay to it even if dex is really high.

Dispel / Mass Dispel:
-Hitting polymorph is really ridiculous, it really makes no sense and also makes the Bloodi Magi skillrace useless
Swordsmanship:
-This skill has become useless. Everyone uses fencing, because the dmg and hit rate of sword weps is too low. There are weps like cutlasses or scimitars that even if Vanq, do little or no dmg. This has to be fixed.

Mace Fighting:
-Same as swords, this skill is too unbalanced compared to fencing, and again there are some hit rates and dmg that are too unbalanced compared to fencing. For example, you have a higher chance to get hit with higher dmg from a pitchfork than a war hammer.

Archery:
-Yew and Charred bows are extremely powerful, the dmg needs to be nerfed a little bit. I said Yew and Charred, but overall all of the bows are too powerful compared to the dropped ones. Economy wise, it would be cool if dropped bows would be removed completely and crafters could actually craft those bows with magical attributes having a set of skill like: Gm Fletching, Gm Magery and for example Poisoning to make poison bows, etc.


PvM:

Drops:
-Daemon bones are too easy to obtain, in 1 hunt, cleaning hythlot lvl 3 you can potentially end up with 1k bones easy.
-Some bosses don’t drop enough gold - timewise, also because the chance of getting a rare is really really low. For example: To kill Skittering Horror it takes roughly 20 minutes, if you hunt in Destard for 20 minutes you can potentially end up with 7-10k, when u kill Skittering Horror you only get 3.
-Armor drops should be removed - bone armor included (Re-enable it on tinkering) This will help stimulate the economy.

Luck:
-Luck works in a sad funny way. It’s frustrating that when you have high luck you waste it most of the time on smaller monsters getting bad drops.
For this matter it should be that higher luck should be triggered by higher monsters. For example, if I kill stronger monsters, I get more luck, but if I keep killing weak monsters my luck will go off soon, getting low drops from low monsters.

Crafting:

Blacksmithing:
-Silver Armor should have 0% fail rate. Its armor and properties make it undesirable to mages, since the 10% is deadly in pvp.
-Weapons crafted with particular ores should have different properties, again, based also on a set of skills.

Masssort:
-Massort is a cool feature, but it should be implemented that you can actually massort stuff from your backpack into a bag for example whenever you craft unsellable stuff, you don’t have to get carpal tunnel to get rid of those objects.

Failrate:
-Failrate is practically 0 right now, which makes stuff less valuable. Put failrate back again on any crafting skill. Obviously at GM it should be 1% and so on.


Economy:

Here there are a few adjustments that should be made that cross with other matters, like crafting.

-Some objects should be removed from vendors to stimulate the economy, besides the vendors in Cove, that should keep those objects.
*Empty bottles
*Logs
*Iron Ingots
*Balls of yarn
*Wool threads
*Blank scrolls (Fix them, make them craftable)
*Blank maps (Fix them, make them craftable) also, the only monsters that drop them are at Mitch’s lair, we should make human chars drop them
*All sorts of gathering tools: Tinker tools, hatchets, smith’s hammers etc.
*Armors
*Weapons
*Arrows & Bolts
*Any kind of Pot
*Higher Regs price (to stop reg runs and let players sell them)
*Any kind of clothing


Rides:
-All stangs have to have different speed/features, so people can use them for purposes

Vampires:
-There are 5 bloodlines. Each bloodline has a master. Most of the masters are not playing anymore. What are we going to do about that?
-When you are not a master you cannot oath any other vampire. This should be fixed.
-Hunter quest is broken.
-Lunar quest is impossible, I say lets wait another while, if no one figures it out, it should be changed.

Noobs:
-Fix tutorial.
-There are a few bugs here and there, if you want we can list them.
-There's no possibility to skip it and choose race.

Races:
-There's should ALWAYS be a race class swap stone.
-There should be the possibility to switch AT LEAST 2 times races.

Staff:

-So we obviously need more staff.
-We need more staff to host events.
-We need more staff that can help new players.
-And finally we need an ACTIVE scripter. Now, a few of us can obviously script, and ok, I know there are some trust issues. But there are also some good trustworthy players like Shooter who would be willing to script, or either us would be willing if told what scripts are needed, or what needs to be fixed.




This post is intended to be discussed by staff, so please do not post here for any reason. There is a discussion post in Obsidian Discussion (viewtopic.php?f=2&t=39853) where we can talk about adding, removing or modifying stuff.

_________________
Quote:
lol I see now... we don't change monster spawns to suit pkers who get owned by them, sorry.


Last edited by Terek Molt on Wed Dec 24, 2014 8:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Obsidian Relaunch.
PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2014 4:27 pm 
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Joined: Thu Nov 02, 2006 4:07 pm
Posts: 1760
Good list, let's go from the top. If there's no comment on something, assume i don't see a problem with it, although that won't mean it'll go in unaltered, just means nothing pops out at first glance:

PvP:

Necromancers:
-Damage of Firewhip has to be changed. Sometimes Firewhip damages for 120+hp and it’s ridiculous. We would like that the max dmg should be capped at 80 (As per capped we mean capped, not that it has always to dmg 80) This is the type of suggestion I like seeing and was expecting when I gave everyone thier assignments awhile back. It says what's wrong, why they think it's wrong, -AND- a way to fix it, which makes it much simpler for me to start from. 80 cap could be feasible, i'll have to look at it
-Firewhip delay has to have a cap. We noticed that players with high dex can cast 3 firewhips in a row with no delay. No mage, warrior nor pvm can survive to such spam. Please fix this matter, put at least a 2 or 3 second delay to it even if dex is really high.

Dispel / Mass Dispel:
-Hitting polymorph is really ridiculous, it really makes no sense and also makes the Bloodi Magi skillrace useless Elaborate here, hitting how, doing what, which blood magi skill? Are you arguing dispel shouldn't hit polymorph at all?
Swordsmanship:
-This skill has become useless. Everyone uses fencing, because the dmg and hit rate of sword weps is too low. There are weps like cutlasses or scimitars that even if Vanq, do little or no dmg. This has to be fixed. So how would you like things changed? Suggested values?

Mace Fighting:
-Same as swords, this skill is too unbalanced compared to fencing, and again there are some hit rates and dmg that are too unbalanced compared to fencing. For example, you have a higher chance to get hit with higher dmg from a pitchfork than a war hammer. Which ones? How would you like it fixed?

Archery:
-Yew and Charred bows are extremely powerful, the dmg needs to be nerfed a little bit. I said Yew and Charred, but overall all of the bows are too powerful compared to the dropped ones. Economy wise, it would be cool if dropped bows would be removed completely and crafters could actually craft those bows with magical attributes having a set of skill like: Gm Fletching, Gm Magery and for example Poisoning to make poison bows, etc. Could be cool, there was a subsystem idea in the works at one point to have magic drops be refined for parts to craft magic weapons. So how far is a "little bit" of a nerf?


PvM:

Drops:
-Daemon bones are too easy to obtain, in 1 hunt, cleaning hythlot lvl 3 you can potentially end up with 1k bones easy. How much would you like to see it reduced? Numbers here would be useful if you think 1k is too much, but 600 would be great, that'd give me a starting viewpoint
-Some bosses don’t drop enough gold - timewise, also because the chance of getting a rare is really really low. For example: To kill Skittering Horror it takes roughly 20 minutes, if you hunt in Destard for 20 minutes you can potentially end up with 7-10k, when u kill Skittering Horror you only get 3. Bosses were never designed to be huge gold farms, but for their specific items and quest purposes.
-Armor drops should be removed - bone armor included (Re-enable it on tinkering) This will help stimulate the economy. Potentially for the future, but economy isn't exactly the biggest worry right now

Luck:
-Luck works in a sad funny way. It’s frustrating that when you have high luck you waste it most of the time on smaller monsters getting bad drops.
For this matter it should be that higher luck should be triggered by higher monsters. For example, if I kill stronger monsters, I get more luck, but if I keep killing weak monsters my luck will go off soon, getting low drops from low monsters.
The most hated response: This was designed this way. The whole point of random drops is just that, they're random. Luck was just implemented to prevent long dry spells. It was suggested originally to let people farm luck to blow on bosses, but in the long run I foresee this making it too easy to farm high level stuff only. Now, that being said, this is sticking to the old UO drop system, like most obsidian stand-bys. If we wanted to completely eradicate it in favor of something more modern (i'm open to ideas), then thats another discussion. But it's a balance between keeping the game "like old UO" and upgrading it, because the old uo had good stuff and bad stuff and stuff that was great back then but looks antiquated now. IT's a hard balance to strike.

Crafting:

Blacksmithing:
-Silver Armor should have 0% fail rate. Its armor and properties make it undesirable to mages, since the 10% is deadly in pvp. It had this at one point, people complained.
-Weapons crafted with particular ores should have different properties, again, based also on a set of skills.

Masssort:
-Massort is a cool feature, but it should be implemented that you can actually massort stuff from your backpack into a bag for example whenever you craft unsellable stuff, you don’t have to get carpal tunnel to get rid of those objects. Really low on the priority list, but at the point i or no one else has anything better to do sure why not

Failrate:
-Failrate is practically 0 right now, which makes stuff less valuable. Put failrate back again on any crafting skill. Obviously at GM it should be 1% and so on. Ok, here's one of those antiquated UO systems that we made a choice on upgrading. Now, here's a question for you: What's the difference between an armor that takes 50 ingots to make, and a 50% fail rate, and an armor that takes 100 ingots to make with no fail rate? Outside of individual player frustration at bad luck, economy-wise it's the same in terms of resources in/resources out. So if we put failrate back in we'd have to lower ingot costs. Also, iirc, there is a fail rate? I'd have to check. (Checked) Nope, we removed it, but it was designed into the system. If anyone can find the comment thread that caused its removal and the above topic, i'm sure it was covered there, i remember it being a few pages


Economy:

Here there are a few adjustments that should be made that cross with other matters, like crafting.

-Some objects should be removed from vendors to stimulate the economy, besides the vendors in Cove, that should keep those objects.
*Empty bottles
*Logs
*Iron Ingots
*Balls of yarn
*Wool threads
*Blank scrolls (Fix them, make them craftable)
*Blank maps (Fix them, make them craftable) also, the only monsters that drop them are at Mitch’s lair, we should make human chars drop them
*All sorts of gathering tools: Tinker tools, hatchets, smith’s hammers etc.
*Armors
*Weapons
*Arrows & Bolts
*Any kind of Pot
*Higher Regs price (to stop reg runs and let players sell them)
*Any kind of clothing
Possible, we'll see. This is a long discussion to be had amongst those who play, as it will vastly change the landscape

Rides:
-All stangs have to have different speed/features, so people can use them for purposes
Speed is a uo limitation. features would have to be designed/balanced/suggested
Vampires:
-There are 5 bloodlines. Each bloodline has a master. Most of the masters are not playing anymore. What are we going to do about that? This was spelled out in the original post, they will be nuked and the quests re-activated, just not high on the list right now
-When you are not a master you cannot oath any other vampire. This should be fixed. This isn't broken. Master's have to allow those under them to oath others, by oathing them twice, explained in original post.
-Hunter quest is broken.How?
-Lunar quest is impossible, I say lets wait another while, if no one figures it out, it should be changed. Nope. Lunar's are a bitch


Noobs:
-Fix tutorial. What's broke?
-There are a few bugs here and there, if you want we can list them. Yes please
-There's no possibility to skip it and choose race.

Races:
-There's should ALWAYS be a race class swap stone. This would be a discussion
-There should be the possibility to switch AT LEAST 2 times races.

Staff:

-So we obviously need more staff.
-We need more staff to host events.
-We need more staff that can help new players.
-And finally we need an ACTIVE scripter. Now, a few of us can obviously script, and ok, I know there are some trust issues. But there are also some good trustworthy players like Shooter who would be willing to script, or either us would be willing if told what scripts are needed, or what needs to be fixed. Yes, we do, but setting everything up takes time.


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 Post subject: Re: Obsidian Relaunch.
PostPosted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 1:13 am 

Joined: Fri Sep 10, 2004 6:34 am
Posts: 2670
Bot Check: GAMER
Location: Boston
Quote:
Good list, let's go from the top. If there's no comment on something, assume i don't see a problem with it, although that won't mean it'll go in unaltered, just means nothing pops out at first glance:

PvP:

Necromancers:
-Damage of Firewhip has to be changed. Sometimes Firewhip damages for 120+hp and it’s ridiculous. We would like that the max dmg should be capped at 80 (As per capped we mean capped, not that it has always to dmg 80) This is the type of suggestion I like seeing and was expecting when I gave everyone thier assignments awhile back. It says what's wrong, why they think it's wrong, -AND- a way to fix it, which makes it much simpler for me to start from. 80 cap could be feasible, i'll have to look at it
-Firewhip delay has to have a cap. We noticed that players with high dex can cast 3 firewhips in a row with no delay. No mage, warrior nor pvm can survive to such spam. Please fix this matter, put at least a 2 or 3 second delay to it even if dex is really high.

Dispel / Mass Dispel:
-Hitting polymorph is really ridiculous, it really makes no sense and also makes the Bloodi Magi skillrace useless Elaborate here, hitting how, doing what, which blood magi skill? Are you arguing dispel shouldn't hit polymorph at all?
By this we meant that we would basically like to see dispel working like the old days, perhaps make it more weak to parry so that PvMs can have at least a little chance to not get dispelled in the first hit.

Swordsmanship:
-This skill has become useless. Everyone uses fencing, because the dmg and hit rate of sword weps is too low. There are weps like cutlasses or scimitars that even if Vanq, do little or no dmg. This has to be fixed. So how would you like things changed? Suggested values?
Mace Fighting:
-Same as swords, this skill is too unbalanced compared to fencing, and again there are some hit rates and dmg that are too unbalanced compared to fencing. For example, you have a higher chance to get hit with higher dmg from a pitchfork than a war hammer. Which ones? How would you like it fixed?
Well, pitchforks are OP, so are magic krysses - So everyone basically switched to fencing for the dps. At this point we would want to see the values of fencing weps lowered (dmg and piercing by, let's say, 3-4) and basically make swords obviously slower than fencing weps but with at least 8 dmg difference and the macing weps slower than swords (eventho I think they are already slow enough) but with a higher dmg (4-5 more than swords) - Of course the piercing is important, as most of the lower swords like cutlasses and scimitars can't pierce high lvl armor even if those weps are vanqs.
Of course those suggested values go from the lower wep type like cutlass for sword, kryss for fencing and maul for mace to the higher wep type like pitchfork for fencing, alabard for swords and war hammer for macing.




Archery:
-Yew and Charred bows are extremely powerful, the dmg needs to be nerfed a little bit. I said Yew and Charred, but overall all of the bows are too powerful compared to the dropped ones. Economy wise, it would be cool if dropped bows would be removed completely and crafters could actually craft those bows with magical attributes having a set of skill like: Gm Fletching, Gm Magery and for example Poisoning to make poison bows, etc. Could be cool, there was a subsystem idea in the works at one point to have magic drops be refined for parts to craft magic weapons. So how far is a "little bit" of a nerf?
Well let's say they need dmg to be dropped at least by 8/10 starting from Yew Bow - but you can see it yourself. Get a Yew/Charred bow and get a Vanq bow- you'll notice the huge difference.


PvM:

Drops:
-Daemon bones are too easy to obtain, in 1 hunt, cleaning hythlot lvl 3 you can potentially end up with 1k bones easy. How much would you like to see it reduced? Numbers here would be useful if you think 1k is too much, but 600 would be great, that'd give me a starting viewpoint
Hunting Daemon Bones was pretty challenging a while ago, we would like to see them removed from lower lvl npcs (gargoyles, fiends etc) and just have them on the higher lvl NPCs with a small decrease (3 instead of 5)
-Some bosses don’t drop enough gold - timewise, also because the chance of getting a rare is really really low. For example: To kill Skittering Horror it takes roughly 20 minutes, if you hunt in Destard for 20 minutes you can potentially end up with 7-10k, when u kill Skittering Horror you only get 3. Bosses were never designed to be huge gold farms, but for their specific items and quest purposes.
Ok
-Armor drops should be removed - bone armor included (Re-enable it on tinkering) This will help stimulate the economy. Potentially for the future, but economy isn't exactly the biggest worry right now
Ok

Luck:
-Luck works in a sad funny way. It’s frustrating that when you have high luck you waste it most of the time on smaller monsters getting bad drops.
For this matter it should be that higher luck should be triggered by higher monsters. For example, if I kill stronger monsters, I get more luck, but if I keep killing weak monsters my luck will go off soon, getting low drops from low monsters.
The most hated response: This was designed this way. The whole point of random drops is just that, they're random. Luck was just implemented to prevent long dry spells. It was suggested originally to let people farm luck to blow on bosses, but in the long run I foresee this making it too easy to farm high level stuff only. Now, that being said, this is sticking to the old UO drop system, like most obsidian stand-bys. If we wanted to completely eradicate it in favor of something more modern (i'm open to ideas), then thats another discussion. But it's a balance between keeping the game "like old UO" and upgrading it, because the old uo had good stuff and bad stuff and stuff that was great back then but looks antiquated now. IT's a hard balance to strike.
We'll start a suggestion post about luck then

Crafting:

Blacksmithing:
-Silver Armor should have 0% fail rate. Its armor and properties make it undesirable to mages, since the 10% is deadly in pvp.
It had this at one point, people complained.
Well now we complain differently. It really doesn't make sense, as 10% in pvp situations can be deadly.

-Weapons crafted with particular ores should have different properties, again, based also on a set of skills.
I know this is not at the top of the list right now


Masssort:
-Massort is a cool feature, but it should be implemented that you can actually massort stuff from your backpack into a bag for example whenever you craft unsellable stuff, you don’t have to get carpal tunnel to get rid of those objects. Really low on the priority list, but at the point i or no one else has anything better to do sure why not
Let's put it like this. When we craft a bunch of stuff like clock parts, that cannot be sold and are tiny pieces of s**t there's no way to get rid of them but manually. And this would definitely help relieve many players from some frustrations of crafting. I'm sure it doesn't require much to just tweak it a little bit like this.

Failrate:
-Failrate is practically 0 right now, which makes stuff less valuable. Put failrate back again on any crafting skill. Obviously at GM it should be 1% and so on.
Ok, here's one of those antiquated UO systems that we made a choice on upgrading. Now, here's a question for you: What's the difference between an armor that takes 50 ingots to make, and a 50% fail rate, and an armor that takes 100 ingots to make with no fail rate? Outside of individual player frustration at bad luck, economy-wise it's the same in terms of resources in/resources out. So if we put failrate back in we'd have to lower ingot costs. Also, iirc, there is a fail rate? I'd have to check. (Checked) Nope, we removed it, but it was designed into the system. If anyone can find the comment thread that caused its removal and the above topic, i'm sure it was covered there, i remember it being a few pages
Apparently most of us have concurred that fail rate should remain untouched.


Economy:

Here there are a few adjustments that should be made that cross with other matters, like crafting.

-Some objects should be removed from vendors to stimulate the economy, besides the vendors in Cove, that should keep those objects.
*Empty bottles
*Logs
*Iron Ingots
*Balls of yarn
*Wool threads
*Blank scrolls (Fix them, make them craftable)
*Blank maps (Fix them, make them craftable) also, the only monsters that drop them are at Mitch’s lair, we should make human chars drop them
*All sorts of gathering tools: Tinker tools, hatchets, smith’s hammers etc.
*Armors
*Weapons
*Arrows & Bolts
*Any kind of Pot
*Higher Regs price (to stop reg runs and let players sell them)
*Any kind of clothing
Possible, we'll see. This is a long discussion to be had amongst those who play, as it will vastly change the landscape
Ok, was a suggestion, of course not at the top of the list

Rides:
-All stangs have to have different speed/features, so people can use them for purposes
Speed is a uo limitation. features would have to be designed/balanced/suggested
Yup, but most of us actually agree on the fact that we don't want any changes. Perhaps in the future make stangs even more rarer

Vampires:
-There are 5 bloodlines. Each bloodline has a master. Most of the masters are not playing anymore. What are we going to do about that? This was spelled out in the original post, they will be nuked and the quests re-activated, just not high on the list right now
I say it's really important, as if new players will come in, at least there are active players with their bloodlines to make game play more pleasant and different - instead of now that you are basically stuck to join 1 bloodline.
-When you are not a master you cannot oath any other vampire. This should be fixed.
This isn't broken. Master's have to allow those under them to oath others, by oathing them twice, explained in original post.
Never saw in the original post saying that masters have to oath twice
-Hunter quest is broken.How? Basically when you double click on the book, it doesn't trigger the quest (doesnt show up in the quest log, as it was supposed to)
-Lunar quest is impossible, I say lets wait another while, if no one figures it out, it should be changed. Nope. Lunar's are a bitch
I don't know about this, I mean, we all have tried with 0 chance..maybe its broken?

Noobs:
-Fix tutorial. What's broke?
-There are a few bugs here and there, if you want we can list them. Yes please
-There's no possibility to skip it and choose race.
I'm not sure, I was told there were a few bugs, I'll open a post on the bug section and see what people have to say, I haven't been there for a while now.

Races:
-There's should ALWAYS be a race class swap stone. This would be a discussion
I'm pretty sure everyone agrees with this. At least Class Swap can make the game more interesting as you were talking about that cross between for example a warrior into a smith, so that the smith would craft better swords if gm swordsmanship, and also people would enjoy more experimenting with different classes/builds instead of being stuck forever with the same char.
-There should be the possibility to switch AT LEAST 2 times races.
Again, we like to experiment, so give us the chance to do it, in this case a couple of times or put a race switch stone that costs 500k or something

Staff:

-So we obviously need more staff.
-We need more staff to host events.
-We need more staff that can help new players.
-And finally we need an ACTIVE scripter. Now, a few of us can obviously script, and ok, I know there are some trust issues. But there are also some good trustworthy players like Shooter who would be willing to script, or either us would be willing if told what scripts are needed, or what needs to be fixed. Yes, we do, but setting everything up takes time.

I know it does, but again, if you would run a test server and let a few of us script on it, we could debug, fix and work it all together, so that the burden is not all on you or the other hypothetical scripter. I mean, all the other shards of any kind of game have 2-3 active ones, we barely have 1, so unless you are planning to hire 2 more besides you right away, you could give us a shot- since we've been around pretty much for 10 years.
So we partially did say something. Now it's up to you Bob. I'm going to start the other discussions on Bugs/Suggestions and see if I can gather more information.

You already have a few things to work on here, so now it's up to you to keep us updated.

As usual, if anyone wants to reply or leave a comment, please do on the discussion post as this is just for Bob to watch and comment.


Also, if you said you gave assignment to some people and they didn't do s**t, don't be shy, post some on forums, I'm sure there will be people willing to help.

_________________
Quote:
lol I see now... we don't change monster spawns to suit pkers who get owned by them, sorry.


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